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  #1   IP: 75.157.247.99
Old 09-26-2011, 01:24 AM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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Bowen Island Paint Job

Hello,
I just bought a rebuilt A4 to replace our rusting 1967 A4. I want to go over her completely, strip and repaint as it has a poor paint job, and add fresh water cooling. The photo below is an old photo of our old A4...very rusty now, but expect I'll be able to rebuild her as well. Want to get her out of the boat so I can rewire and clean up the engine room.
Millions of questions! To start with I'm trying to figure out what year our new A4 might be. Has a MM head and MM manifold and was rebuilt in 2009 and then run only 4 hours.
Has a sheet metal flywheel cover, oil fill forward, has the little snap open oil fill box just forward of the water pump, has the big Delco distributor with points.

I like the cast iron cover so much better, as well as my old style starter. Could I swap over both....maybe need to swap flywheel as well? I'm out of my depth here, don't know if that is possible or a bad idea.

I put electronic ignition on my old, small Prestolite dist. Can I swap that over to the new A4 as well and replace the Delco?

Any reason not to make these changes (if I can)? Is the bigger style starter better?

Lots to sort out!

Thanks for any advice,
Marty (1967 T 27 Poseidon)
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Old 09-26-2011, 08:01 AM
hanleyclifford hanleyclifford is offline
 
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You've got a real "cobble job". New style head, early gearcase cover, late distributor, early starter and (obviously) early flywheel but with late flywheel housing. Somebody went to work. Oil fill forward suggests late block. Starters and flywheels, early and late, go together. If you don't already have one I suggest you get the Moyer Marine Overhaul and Service Manual available on this site.
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Old 09-26-2011, 09:13 AM
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I swapped my big Delco distributor out for the smaller Prestolite with EI over a year ago. It works and I have better alternator belt clearance.
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1967 Islander 29
Harbor Island, San Diego
2/7/67 A4 Engine Block date
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Old 09-26-2011, 09:38 AM
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sastanley sastanley is offline
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Marty, the block date is stamped on the block behind the carb & just under the breather hole & valve cover.

Mine is 041976 - which I am pretty sure indicates April 19, 1976. Ignore the pretty 6 digit embossed number nearby.. I think it is some kind of casting number & is the same on lots of blocks.

Here is a dim picture where you can see the casting date just above the flame arrestor.
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"Twice Around" - '77 Catalina 30, #511 with original A-4, but she does have an MMI manifold.
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http://www.moyermarine.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic3231_6.gif

Last edited by sastanley; 09-26-2011 at 09:40 AM.
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Old 09-26-2011, 09:39 AM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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swaps from 1967 to rebuilt

Thank you for your replies. Just to be clear, the photo on post #1 is of my old (now rusty) 1967 A4.
Good to know I can swap distributor.
So, if I want to use my old cast iron flywheel cover I need to also swap:
flywheel
flywheel housing
starter
....is that correct?

...thanks!
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Old 09-26-2011, 09:55 AM
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I think bolt pattern is the same for the fly wheel covers. Not sure about starters though, but I suspect they are the same too.

Can you Put the two engines in the same room and check?
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1967 Islander 29
Harbor Island, San Diego
2/7/67 A4 Engine Block date
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:00 AM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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Serial numbers

I think it says 052379 on the block, above the carb...does that make any sense?
I removed the blue paint (who would paint that?) from the copper lubrication instruction plate on the transmission. Almost all the info is gone, but at the bottom can still read stamped UJ 74688. Probably an older tranny?

-Marty
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:07 AM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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flywheel cover + SN

Thanks Jim,

I was posting when your reply came in. Old A4 is on the boat (Vancouver). New A4 is on an engine stand here on Bowen Island.I'll bring home the old flywheel cover later this week and compare. So, Do the two types of starters need different flywheels?

So SN = block is May 23 1979?

Thanks!
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:07 AM
hanleyclifford hanleyclifford is offline
 
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Talking

You can definitely use your old cast iron flywheel housing with the early starter and flywheel. In some cases (mine for example) I use the new (Delco) starter and flywheel with the cast (early) housing. Don Moyer has a discussion of this in The Manual.
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:09 AM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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flyweel cvr

Thanks! Didn't know that was in the manual....I'll bring that home tonight.
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:31 AM
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yes, May 23 1979
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1967 Islander 29
Harbor Island, San Diego
2/7/67 A4 Engine Block date
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:47 AM
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"I removed the blue paint (who would paint that?) from the copper lubrication instruction plate on the transmission. Almost all the info is gone, but at the bottom can still read stamped UJ 74688. Probably an older tranny?"

Based on my tranny/engine # 77414 your tranny is pre 1965. Dan S/V Marian Claire

Last edited by Marian Claire; 09-26-2011 at 11:25 AM.
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Old 09-26-2011, 10:59 AM
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If it is late model Marty, the serial number itself is stamped right next to the oil fill, above the flywheel cover. If your stamp date is indeed 1979, your serial number may be over 200,000...one of the later blocks.
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-Shawn
"Twice Around" - '77 Catalina 30, #511 with original A-4, but she does have an MMI manifold.
Spring is just around the corner!!!

http://www.moyermarine.com/forums/signaturepics/sigpic3231_6.gif
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  #14   IP: 75.157.247.99
Old 09-27-2011, 11:34 AM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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Starter question

Can anyone tell me if this is a match for the A4:

Replaces Part Numbers:

DELCO 1998310

OEM(s): Delco
Type: DD
Voltage: 12 Volts
Rotation: CW
Teeth/Splines: 9 Teeth/Splines

Thanks,
Marty
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Old 09-27-2011, 02:20 PM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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new starter

Well, on e-bay I found a company selling new, unused Delco starters for the A4. Spoke with them on the phone, and these starters are listed as replacements for #1107679. That number matches the Delco # on Robert Hess's site.

http://www.cncphotoalbum.com/atomic4/atomic4specs.htm

There are more available: the e-bay item # is: 120691637753 Cost is $159.95 + shipping.

Hope that is useful to someone!

-Marty
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Old 09-27-2011, 04:38 PM
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Not to forget that it should be sealed against any sparking gas fumes. Is it designed for marine use?
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Old 09-27-2011, 05:11 PM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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marine environment starter

Thanks for that Lat64,
....wasn't thinking about that aspect. I may need the Delco rubber solenoid gasket that MM sells. I'll disassemble new starter and compare to the one that came with the engine.
I have no reason to believe that the included starter is faulty (was told it was rebuilt in 2009), but couldn't pass up starting off with a fresh one....keep the old one for a spare....but too heavy to keep on the boat (even for me - I'm a maniac about spares: cruise with spare carb, coil, distributor guts, thermostat, fuel pump, Raycor filter...even my old 2 blade prop! That list doesn't include the normal tune-up stuff).

-Marty
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Old 10-09-2011, 11:37 PM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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tool for rust removal

Hey All - and happy Thanksgiving to any Canadians tuning in,

Wondering what is the best power tool for the major paint & rust removal. I have a 4.5" angle grinder, and wondering what style wire brush or whatever others have found best. Maybe a rougher and a courser? Drill attachments? I have a dremel tool for the less accessible areas, and wondering what the best attachments are for that, too. Lastly (for now!) solvents, rust removers?

Thanks in advance,
Marty
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Old 10-09-2011, 11:57 PM
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I use acetone then a bench mounted wire wheel/buffer. Get something that is durable. I mean, something that doesn't shed it's bristles into your face. I tried a wire wheel on my dremel and I got pummeled with wire.
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1967 Islander 29
Harbor Island, San Diego
2/7/67 A4 Engine Block date

Last edited by jpian0923; 10-10-2011 at 12:10 AM.
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Old 10-10-2011, 07:41 AM
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I used a wire wheel in a hand drill with good results.
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Old 10-30-2011, 01:13 PM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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oil pan

Just about to remove the oil pan. Flywheel housing, exhaust manifold are removed. Aft housing is still in place.

Part 1 is drop the pan with the engine upright (on an engine stand) to contain whatever is in there (oil is drained but I'm sure there's a bit more). Can anyone give me an idea how heavy that will be? Anything special I need to know?

Part 2 is clean up the pan, repaint.

Part 3 is turn the engine upside down to inspect and install a new gasket and old pan with new screws.

Any advice about the above and what to look for gratefully received!

Thanks,
Marty
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Old 10-30-2011, 01:28 PM
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I am guessing based on hauling my oil pan around during rebuild. Say 25#s Dan S/V Marian Claire
You could call Ken at the parts # at Moyer and he should have a shipping weight.

Last edited by Marian Claire; 10-30-2011 at 02:01 PM.
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Old 10-30-2011, 02:10 PM
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Weight is 37lbs.

I removed mine when it was upside down. It's pinned in a couple of places. Might be easier upside down so you don't drop it when it finally brakes free.
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S/V "Ahoi"
1967 Islander 29
Harbor Island, San Diego
2/7/67 A4 Engine Block date
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Old 10-30-2011, 02:27 PM
Marty Levenson Marty Levenson is online now
 
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which way up?

Thanks to both for the advice: I didn't know it was pinned! I do like the idea of keeping the pan upright so any old glop or metal bits don't drip back into the engine. I have no idea what's in there.

I think we'll put some safety straps around the pan and block in case it slips.

Pictures to follow...
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Old 10-30-2011, 02:38 PM
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You do make a good point about metal bits falling into engine if it is upside down. But, while she is open you'll probably clean up whatever you can reach though. Straps are a good idea. Also, make sure you pull it straight off to avoid ruining the oil pump screen.
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2/7/67 A4 Engine Block date
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